Tuesday 26 June 2007

To menteri and freeway



cruzeiro wrote:

freeway wrote,
as well the cheapest tools of labelling and bashing(cruziero).

=======================

Hey now, take it easy okay - I never
bashed Islam, per se.
I had visited a link given by FFT, and found it truly hilarious ...... (too bad, some people have lost their sense of humour, and have forgotten how to laugh - even if it is at themselves for being silly)
Confirming my suspicions, he took it as an insult to Islam from ME, and not the guys who "did the damage"! So, the humor in it was lost .... and anger had taken over.
I truly cannot understand this justification of the "Rage" that is very much prevalent in Muslim communities.
If you have noticed, none of these sanctimonious "defenders of the faith" would come out boldly to condemn this behaviour.
It is this that I spoke about in my letter to RPK - "The Pathology of Rage" - it is destroying Muslim communities worldwide, and has "isolated" them from other communities worldwide. It has brought about silent disdain from the peaceful, and retribution from the militants. It has bred hatred in the Islamists, and destoyed the Image that the rational ones have built over the years. It is this "hatred" and rebellion against hostility that drives the desire for the fundamentalism of the middle ages to be established for an Islamic Utopia.
If you go back to my posts, it was a "pattern of behaviour" that I had "labelled and bashed" - mind you, I even included christians.
In fact, all I wanted to know was whether such irrational rage is condoned, by those who advertise their verbose religiosity, but seem to know nothing about spirituality.
The problem with you guys is, you get so defensive and paranoid, and think that the whole world is out to screw you people - so much so, you think that everything is about Islam.
No lah, there are some things in this world which don't have to be about Islam.
So when you are free, have a kit-kat and read through what I wrote.
Maybe you'll understand.
BTW, RPK, maybe you can write something about this "rage" thingy, by the various religious groups?
26/06 09:56:10

SKC wrote:

Dear All who disagreed with YM RPK,
Think about it, would it be better to have a really deep look into yourself ? Can you see anything at all ? Who are you ? Where are you heading ? What do you hope and dream about ?
As YM RPK has say this has nothing to do with religion. Think about it.
26/06 10:38:42

SKC wrote:

Dear YM RPK,
You are trying too hard, it is getting the negative effect, relax man, have a break and give them (Us) a break also, this sort of things take time. We cannot mature overnight, I might not even see this maturity, sign.......
But Hey ! life goes on.
Never stop trying, for you have done what many has fail to do and even some very powerfull men has given up on.
26/06 10:44:30

FrenchFriedTacos wrote:

cruzeiro said:
Confirming my suspicions, he took it as an insult to Islam from ME, and not the guys who "did the damage"! So, the humor in it was lost .... and anger had taken over.
I truly cannot understand this justification of the "Rage" that is very much prevalent in Muslim communities.
-------------------------------------------

How dare you make fun of "Rage"?

Did you not know, it is one of the new "pillars" of the modern-day practice of Islam.

The more Rage you exhibit, the more Islamic you are perceived as being.

Which is why even locally, we are seeing small but loaded examples of peacock-feather-fluffing games of oneupmanship in terms of Rage between UMNO and PAS. On the PAS side of the ring, they take to the streets for every little reason and scream Allahu Akhbar until their brown faces turn purple and threaten "Death to [enter Muslim bogeyman of the day]!" On the UMNO side of the ring, you can see keris waving, unsheathing and inserting, and also the phenomenal ac of Rage by one son-in-law who made a monkey of himself to get Condi Rice's attention while she was on official visit to Malaysia.

Raging is the new Islamic cool. If you ain't ragin', then you're failin'.
26/06 11:00:52

cruzeiro wrote:

Raging is the new Islamic cool. If you ain't ragin', then you're failin'.

=================
LOL.
26/06 11:06:41

menteri wrote:

Cruzeiro, FFT & Anon do you think Malay will be better-off if they give up Islam?
26/06 11:20:16

suv wrote:

Hey d1ckheadpotatohead aka fft

What wil u do,if someone is raping u?
26/06 11:42:54

SKC wrote:

Dear menteri,
That is like poring petrol into a raging fire. (No help at all)
It is not Islam, it is a classical example of someone who has landed him or her self into a situation they are not qualify to handler, therefore the raging, for it hides many short comings and very easy to manipulate.
This raging also plays on the fear in each one of us, almost a marriage make in heaven, what do you expect ? Honor ? Nobility of purpose ?????
26/06 11:44:56

anon wrote:

menteri,

I know if Malays give up the wahhabi version, they will surely be better off.

Then we might have a tolerant Islamic society that respects other religions too.

If they agree to RPK's article then we just might see the way to a more harmonious intermingling of all races.

Ahh, the good ole days when we mixed freely and had loads of fun. That was before the coming of the consciousness of race and religion.

Never did I see Malay girls with tudungs and rempits and khalwats and kafirs and all other kinds of deviant thoughts that have now divided not just the Muslims against the non-Muslims but also Muslims against Muslims too.

Sometimes I like to dream la, cannot ah?

Cheers.
26/06 11:44:58

suv wrote:

The shallowness and kebodohan of fft and his stooges r amazing.Tau cakap ingerisu bukan bermakna pandai dlm segala galanya.Aah,not surprisningly buffons like them r still blablaing here,and not xcersing thier supreme intelleck in some cutting edge technology in the the West.
26/06 11:48:26

SKC wrote:

Dear Anon,
Dreaming is good, I still remember we (a whole group of all races) use to sing late into the night on an open field watching the stars go by. Ahhh, the power of dreams.
26/06 11:52:01

anon wrote:

Oops, I forgot ....

I have a dream.

Cheers to all the raging bulls.

cruz, even with all this new contorted Islamic versions, I still am able to laugh - at them.

Laughter is the best medicine. Like you said, a lot have forgotten how to laugh as they have exhausted their energy trying so hard to prove that they are the New Age Messiahs with a panacea to cure the world and make it a 'clean' by eliminating kafirs, be it Hindus, Christians, Buddhists and all other religions of the world.

Cheers.
26/06 11:59:22

anon wrote:

SKC,

You are right of couse. But sad la when you have to come back to earth again and deal with realities.

I too was speaking about my friends, of mixed races having a great time.

What the heck happened? We were all so close and sat and quarreled and laughed together.

Cheers.
26/06 12:04:47

cruzeiro wrote:

menteri wrote:
Cruzeiro, FFT & Anon do you think Malay will be better-off if they give up Islam?
===================
Dear menteri,
I believe you have asked the wrong question. It would've been better had you asked, "Would Malays be better off if they stopped trying too hard to recreate their identity thru religiosity (as opposed to spirituality)?".
Anyway, I'll give you an answer based on what I perceive which may not necessarily be accurate.
The Malay Identity has been corrupted and partly destroyed by "arabisation" as RPK had mentioned.Remember, Islam and Arab culture are very different.
If arabisation is what you would qualify as Islam, by all means - they'd definitely be better off without it.
However, they would be no better off should they adopt christianity, and try to practice "white man" culture, or adopt hinduism and practice indian culture. Same goes for every other religion and the dominant culture practicing it.
The one major factor that has contributed to the corruption of Islam, is the arab struggle for self determination, and it's humiliation as a result of foreign domination - aka today as the "Palestian Cause".
Violent "Successes" by these terrorists/ fighters are misrepresented as achievements of Islamic doctrine!
This can be seen and heard on Malaysian and pro-palestinian media - children and women who become suicide bombers killing innocents, are described as "pejuang berani mati" lending it glory!
These arabs have successfully hijacked Islam as the rallying call to create a "palestinian state" and made it an "Islamic Cause" - and from their logic, if you're not with us, you're against us.
Bear in mind that the two have nothing in common - and yet, this violent and intolerant culture has creeped into Islam (therefore, as FFT says - it's the new "Islamic Cool").
"Malays" and Muslims worldwide should learn to look at the Palestinian conflict as a political struggle for land, power and wealth, rather than an Islamic struggle.
I hope you are clear.
26/06 12:21:44

cruzeiro wrote:

Oh Anon,
I recently decided to publish all my postings and all postings relevant to my comments from MT in my blog.
RPK, hope your comments aren't "copyrighted" you're there too where relevant.
Of course not all thots are published to avoid problems ......
those who want their comments deleted, pls let me know.
To all you guys who wish to thrash me, you too are welcome to

http://cruzinthots.blogspot...
26/06 13:15:51

anon wrote:

cruz bro,

What a coincidence. I too was about to publish all my articles instead of keeping them in draft.

Last time I went in, I saw about 12 in the draft. I wrote the truth and why should I not publish it?

I shall go in there and see what I wish to publish.

In case, some in here and elsewhere need to read about The Untouchables and posts like that.

I wanted to post them as I see quite a few in here do not seem to be aware that there are good non-Muslims too.

When I see and read comments here that seem sanctimonious, all the more I want to publish some of my articles.

So, to all who wish to read and pass comments, be my guest.

http//anonpartisan.blogspot.com

Especially the articles sent to RPK.
26/06 13:27:44

anon wrote:

sagaladoola,

Sorry for the delay but this is address. Happy reading.

Cheers.
26/06 13:28:57

temenggong wrote:

Islam (as it is known and practised today aka Arab Batu Religion) is a prison. It is an enslavement policy. It makes dhimmis of muslims.

Slaves don't think but just follow. They have submitted, to enslavement.
26/06 13:38:47

FrenchFriedTacos wrote:

suv wrote:
Hey d1ckheadpotatohead aka fft
What wil u do,if someone is raping u?
-----------------------------------------

I'll stop them, hand them a tenner, and send them to rape you.
26/06 14:21:38

FrenchFriedTacos wrote:

menteri wrote:
Cruzeiro, FFT & Anon do you think Malay will be better-off if they give up Islam?
------------------------------------------

Let me put it this way:

Malays will be better off if they know what Islam IS in the first place.
26/06 14:22:51

menteri wrote:

Anon :
I know if Malays give up the wahhabi version, they will surely be better off.

All Malays are wahhabi, Instead of wahhabi, what are the alternative?

Don't destroy the broken vessel unless you can replace it with a good one.

Dear Anon, you are unintentionally playing hit & run games despite your writing reflects how you care for others.

To the real people, What lies behind them and what lies ahead of them are tiny matters compared to what lives within them.

Perhaps living within the lie is better off while everybody is not ready for the truth as suggested in this article.

Cruzeiro is not even convinced that christianity, hinduism.... can be of any help.

So how?
26/06 14:32:58

cruzeiro wrote:

menteri wrote:
Cruzeiro is not even convinced that christianity, hinduism.... can be of any help.
=================
Menteri,
I never said any faith won't be of any help.
don't twist my words - I said, that it wouldn't help only if you chose to ape the dominant culture of the faith not the faith/ theology/ philosophy per se.
Pls read it again if you must.
26/06 14:39:42

anon wrote:

menteri wrote:
Anon :All Malays are wahhabi, Instead of wahhabi, what are the alternative?

Don't destroy the broken vessel unless you can replace it with a good one.

Dear Anon, you are unintentionally playing hit & run games despite your writing reflects how you care for others.
----------------------------------------
Dear menteri,

I do not wish to be tautological but do read RPK's article. Looks like you did not make an effort to read it carefully.

By your own admission, you mentioned a broken vessel. That is good. You seem to realize that the vessel is indeed broken. How long do you think that broken vessel will last?

Unintentionally playing hit-and-run games? There lies your failure to understand people.

With regards to religion, I do nor play games, unintentionally or otherwise. Then again, I do not expect you to understand me as a lot in here share your views about me.

As you said: To the real people, What lies behind them and what lies ahead of them are tiny matters compared to what lives within them.

Very true but .... who are these real people? You? The anti RPKs? People who call non-Muslims kafirs?

If you read RPK's article with an open mind, you will find all the answers. A vessel that is united and strong is presented to you on a silver platter but you fail to recognize it.
26/06 15:06:25

anon wrote:

menteri,

Btw, please do not twist and contort what I said.

I did not say ALL Malays are wahhabis.

If I did, I challenge you to copy paste it here.

Seems like you have a flair for twisting what people say, for reasons best known to you.
26/06 15:11:41

cruzeiro wrote:

who was that who gave that link on shaking hands with jews, shardik was it?

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

This is what I meant - they have hijacked the religion with their hatred .... they are so foolish in their statements!
26/06 15:12:46

SKC wrote:

Dear menteri,
Relax man, all these couldn't be good for your blood pressure. Please read my posting, posted on 26/06 10:38:42.
I for one would not ask u to give up anything, maybe just looking at it again and judge for yourself if changes needs to be done.
26/06 15:23:39

anon wrote:

menteri,

I know if Malays give up the wahhabi version, they will surely be better off.
----------------------------------------

That is what I said as a follow up on those radicals.

Ok, let me first say ( and I am not giving excuses ) that I meant, these Malays which I did not insert. I should have and then you would be clear of what I meant.

I thought I made myself clear earlier on moderate Malays and the ones on the other side.

If the Malays were offended by that, then I sincerely apologize. It was not my intention to generalize.

Think of it this way menteri. My Abah is also a Malay. Do you really believe that I would say that and mean ALL Malays? Which would mean even Abah who is certainly not a wahhabi.

If I do say ALL Malays, it would mean RPK too who is certainly not a wahhabi too.

There are other Malays here too who do not subscribe to the wahhabi version of Islam.

I shall be very careful when I reply you henceforth as you are rather hasty jumping to conclusions.

You too have my apology if you thought I meant ALL Malays.
26/06 15:26:44

menteri wrote:

cruzeiro :
However, they would be no better off should they adopt christianity, and try to practice "white man" culture, or adopt hinduism and practice indian culture. Same goes for every other religion and the dominant culture practicing it...

I never said any faith won't be of any help...

Menteri :
May be other faith will help?
Pls forgive me for my ignorant, I don't read btw lines but you are extremely good at writing btw lines.

FFT:
Let me put it this way:

Malays will be better off if they know what Islam IS in the first place.

Menteri :
Hmm.. It does make some sense. Ya..a bit of self clarification and enlightenment can be good.

But I don't think this dream will come true....
26/06 15:44:12

anon wrote:

menteri,

Let me make it easier for you to understand.

I said:

I know if Malays give up the wahhabi version, they will surely be better off.
----------------------------------------

I shall rephrase it .... if the Malays give up the wahhabi version .... simply means the Malays who subscribe to the wahhabi version of Islam .... and certainly not the rest of the Malays.

I hope you understand now. Look for the semantics of the language please.

Peace.
26/06 15:44:25

anon wrote:

cruz,

I do hope all Malaysians watch that Shaking hands with the Jews along with the replies.

It would be nice to know how many agree with those pitiful people.

Cheers.
26/06 16:19:52

cruzeiro wrote:

Losing My Religion
R.E.M.

Life is bigger
It's bigger than you
And you are not me
The lengths that I will go to
The distance in your eyes
Oh no I've said too much
I set it up

That's me in the corner
That's me in the spotlight
Losing my religion
Trying to keep up with you
And I don't know if I can do it
Oh no I've said too much
I haven't said enough
I thought that I heard you laughing
I thought that I heard you sing
I think I thought I saw you try

Every whisper
Of every waking hour I'm
Choosing my confessions
Trying to keep an eye on you
Like a hurt lost and blinded fool
Oh no I've said too much
I set it up

Consider this
The hint of the century
Consider this
The slip that brought me
To my knees failed
What if all these fantasies
Come flailing around
Now I've said too much
I thought that I heard you laughing
I thought that I heard you sing
I think I thought I saw you try

But that was just a dream
That was just a dream
26/06 17:18:32

cruzeiro wrote:

menteri,

that was for you ....
26/06 17:27:39

Reply to menteri: Malays better without Islam?



cruzeiro wrote:

menteri wrote:
Cruzeiro, FFT & Anon do you think Malay will be better-off if they give up Islam?
===================
Dear menteri,
I believe you have asked the wrong question. It would've been better had you asked, "Would Malays be better off if they stopped trying too hard to recreate their identity thru religiosity (as opposed to spirituality)?".
Anyway, I'll give you an answer based on what I perceive which may not necessarily be accurate.
The Malay Identity has been corrupted and partly destroyed by "arabisation" as RPK had mentioned.Remember, Islam and Arab culture are very different.
If arabisation is what you would qualify as Islam, by all means - they'd definitely be better off without it.
However, they would be no better off should they adopt christianity, and try to practice "white man" culture, or adopt hinduism and practice indian culture. Same goes for every other religion and the dominant culture practicing it.
The one major factor that has contributed to the corruption of Islam, is the arab struggle for self determination, and it's humiliation as a result of foreign domination - aka today as the "Palestian Cause".
Violent "Successes" by these terrorists/ fighters are misrepresented as achievements of Islamic doctrine!
This can be seen and heard on Malaysian and pro-palestinian media - children and women who become suicide bombers killing innocents, are described as "pejuang berani mati" lending it glory!
These arabs have successfully hijacked Islam as the rallying call to create a "palestinian state" and made it an "Islamic Cause" - and from their logic, if you're not with us, you're against us.
Bear in mind that the two have nothing in common - and yet, this violent and intolerant culture has creeped into Islam (therefore, as FFT says - it's the new "Islamic Cool").
"Malays" and Muslims worldwide should learn to look at the Palestinian conflict as a political struggle for land, power and wealth, rather than an Islamic struggle.
I hope you are clear.
26/06 12:21:44


menteri wrote:

Cruzeiro, FFT & Anon do you think Malay will be better-off if they give up Islam?

anon wrote:

Oops, I forgot ....

I have a dream.

Cheers to all the raging bulls.

cruz, even with all this new contorted Islamic versions, I still am able to laugh - at them.

Laughter is the best medicine. Like you said, a lot have forgotten how to laugh as they have exhausted their energy trying so hard to prove that they are the New Age Messiahs with a panacea to cure the world and make it a 'clean' by eliminating kafirs, be it Hindus, Christians, Buddhists and all other religions of the world.

Cheers.




FFT's response



FrenchFriedTacos wrote:

cruzeiro said:
Confirming my suspicions, he took it as an insult to Islam from ME, and not the guys who "did the damage"! So, the humor in it was lost .... and anger had taken over.
I truly cannot understand this justification of the "Rage" that is very much prevalent in Muslim communities.
-------------------------------------------

How dare you make fun of "Rage"?

Did you not know, it is one of the new "pillars" of the modern-day practice of Islam.

The more Rage you exhibit, the more Islamic you are perceived as being.

Which is why even locally, we are seeing small but loaded examples of peacock-feather-fluffing games of oneupmanship in terms of Rage between UMNO and PAS. On the PAS side of the ring, they take to the streets for every little reason and scream Allahu Akhbar until their brown faces turn purple and threaten "Death to [enter Muslim bogeyman of the day]!" On the UMNO side of the ring, you can see keris waving, unsheathing and inserting, and also the phenomenal ac of Rage by one son-in-law who made a monkey of himself to get Condi Rice's attention while she was on official visit to Malaysia.

Raging is the new Islamic cool. If you ain't ragin', then you're failin'.
26/06 11:00:52

Islam Bashing? My response



freewaay wrote:

OK gorshan, you got our respect, no one here is brave enough to ridicule your religion, but the exception of Islam, we're being attack from all sides and being argued using state of the art scientific theory(beinghuman), as well the cheapest tools of labelling and bashing(cruziero). But don't worry, Islam is dynamic enough to withstand this challenge.

Thanks.

cruzeiro wrote:

freeway wrote,
as well the cheapest tools of labelling and bashing(cruziero).

=======================

Hey now, take it easy okay - I never
bashed Islam, per se.
I had visited a link given by FFT, and found it truly hilarious ...... (too bad, some people have lost their sense of humour, and have forgotten how to laugh - even if it is at themselves for being silly)
Confirming my suspicions, he took it as an insult to Islam from ME, and not the guys who "did the damage"! So, the humor in it was lost .... and anger had taken over.
I truly cannot understand this justification of the "Rage" that is very much prevalent in Muslim communities.
If you have noticed, none of these sanctimonious "defenders of the faith" would come out boldly to condemn this behaviour.
It is this that I spoke about in my letter to RPK - "The Pathology of Rage" - it is destroying Muslim communities worldwide, and has "isolated" them from other communities worldwide. It has brought about silent disdain from the peaceful, and retribution from the militants. It has bred hatred in the Islamists, and destoyed the Image that the rational ones have built over the years. It is this "hatred" and rebellion against hostility that drives the desire for the fundamentalism of the middle ages to be established for an Islamic Utopia.
If you go back to my posts, it was a "pattern of behaviour" that I had "labelled and bashed" - mind you, I even included christians.
In fact, all I wanted to know was whether such irrational rage is condoned, by those who advertise their verbose religiosity, but seem to know nothing about spirituality.
The problem with you guys is, you get so defensive and paranoid, and think that the whole world is out to screw you people - so much so, you think that everything is about Islam.
No lah, there are some things in this world which don't have to be about Islam.
So when you are free, have a kit-kat and read through what I wrote.
Maybe you'll understand.
BTW, RPK, maybe you can write something about this "rage" thingy, by the various religious groups?
26/06 09:56:10